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Post by ManaKhe on Feb 5, 2015 8:18:33 GMT
Does the skill resist not multiply itself with the mdef to reduce anything? I just read up on the skill that its a magic resistance passive skill so maybe at level 3 its times 3 or something (not sure tbh) Magic defense force Magic the damage formula = {enemy MATK + random value (0 to about 20% of the enemy MATK) - MDEF × (1 + MDEF%)} × (1- magic resistance) This formula is from the wiki and it says it multiplies mdef with magic r so idk maybe i should try some tests with matk bossess Resist (passive) I wear resistance to magic attacks. Always own magic resistance is rising. SLv1 learning during Holy Knight apprentice career change Magic Resistance is taken at the end of all other calculations. So basically what thats saying is say... the enemy's MATK is 10k and I have 1k MDEF and 25% Magic Resistance. So that would be 10000-1000=9000 damage. Now you multiply that by (1-.25) or .75. So 9000x.75=6750 damage. The MDEF% portion probably shouldn't have been there lol. While it seems Magic Res has an enormous effect compared to MDEF it isn't quite that big of a difference. For 1 we don't really know MATK values for bosses as we can't go by how hard they hit with magic since they probably have damage multipliers like we do. So it's probably more like: Enemy MATK-MDEF x Damage Multipliers(something like Crits or just how different skills do more damage than others)x(1-Magic Res) So if the multipliers are actually really high on stuff then MDEF may make a bigger impact than you would think. However in general I've found Resistance stats to be more effective in reducing damage overall.
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Post by MiLiGRiTo on Feb 5, 2015 11:27:40 GMT
Base multiplier for guardian dmg is affected by atk so dex is better with special swords. I use str because I have normal swords. There may or may not be str factor but if it does have then it is probably just plain figure (no multiplier except element) which is similar to what jp wiki suggests.
I have no proof that magic hits critical. The battle log reports critical but it is physical damage.
I went to shojo270 and megas to check magic dmg. I have 150mdef and no magic res gear They both hit around 3k magic and 1.5kdmg when I have fortis. Megaroches ice spear hits slightly less but lets just use rounded numbers.
Let me know what you get and we'll try to figure it out with actual results.
EDIT: I checked youtube solo Almas video and compared the magic damage I get versus a VIT/INT build and I receive similar damage to what he gets. Of course he gets slightly less (I get 10k he gets 9k). With magic resistance penalty, the data is similar (pretty hard to tell exact figures because of random factor but we are both playing around 20k damage, with maybe around 1k to 2k difference)
Advantage of INT and MDEF might be significant on lower magic damage like shojo's and megaroche's but I could not tell for certain until I can get more data.
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Post by amjroid on Feb 10, 2015 2:07:44 GMT
Has anybody looked into the affect of agi on the parry/stun parry skill? I know that in other MMOs, agility tends to raise parry rate. Also the Hoplon up shield gives a def bonus based on agi. Would they put that bonus on a shield if they assume paladins will never raise agi? I could not say for certain what affects the parry rate, but I doubt that it has anything to do with AGI. Some gears are there to suggest different builds (e.g. HW/Bishop may add AGI so they boost their MATK with Magic Amplifier equipment, Instead of the typical INT/DEX/VIT build) Just would like to clarify that I'm not saying that a Pally with AGI won't work or is a lousy build, it can work well for those who prefer a different playstyle than spamming guardian. It can also work well with lazy farm/leveling, say for example attack 3 megaroches then be AFK then comeback every now and then to rinse and repeat, preferrably wearing a shield (to boost stun parry) and boost your CRT rate with abilities and gears, since crit is very effective DPS for auto attack. The important stat for a Pally is VIT, any other stat you place after that is ok depending on what you aim to have. FYI, I ended up trying a pally build with max AGI and ran a test by equipping a hoplon and forest spirit (1 dmg on earth attribute) and hacking away at a kijimu for a while. I did the same thing with a AGI = 1 build and for both cases I got ~50% parry rate. So I'm concluding that parry rate isn't affected by AGI. Besides that, I also want to say that maxing AGI for a guardian spam is a bad idea unless you have some ASPD reduction equipment. You will get an autoattack between every guardian and reduce your guardian/sec rate by about 1/3 ~___~...
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Post by Tilt*Madara on Feb 10, 2015 5:16:52 GMT
I could not say for certain what affects the parry rate, but I doubt that it has anything to do with AGI. Some gears are there to suggest different builds (e.g. HW/Bishop may add AGI so they boost their MATK with Magic Amplifier equipment, Instead of the typical INT/DEX/VIT build) Just would like to clarify that I'm not saying that a Pally with AGI won't work or is a lousy build, it can work well for those who prefer a different playstyle than spamming guardian. It can also work well with lazy farm/leveling, say for example attack 3 megaroches then be AFK then comeback every now and then to rinse and repeat, preferrably wearing a shield (to boost stun parry) and boost your CRT rate with abilities and gears, since crit is very effective DPS for auto attack. The important stat for a Pally is VIT, any other stat you place after that is ok depending on what you aim to have. FYI, I ended up trying a pally build with max AGI and ran a test by equipping a hoplon and forest spirit (1 dmg on earth attribute) and hacking away at a kijimu for a while. I did the same thing with a AGI = 1 build and for both cases I got ~50% parry rate. So I'm concluding that parry rate isn't affected by AGI. Besides that, I also want to say that maxing AGI for a guardian spam is a bad idea unless you have some ASPD reduction equipment. You will get an autoattack between every guardian and reduce your guardian/sec rate by about 1/3 ~___~... lol thats pretty much what he predicted. And he said that if you add agi it would be for something different/not/other than spamming guardian.
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Post by bohant on Feb 10, 2015 7:07:38 GMT
Well I don't know how anyone would ever think vit/int/dex is not a pally tank build. I use this build and there might be like 5 bosses in game I cant solo. With having Dex you gain so much mdef and cast speed its helps keep hate. I use ultimi or litch armor, witch makes me able to use guardian every 2 sec. I don't recall the last time I needed to use voke cause of my speed. My HP is high, 140k just my buffs. I have tanked every boss in game with no problem including sauro 170,Almas,tarna and raton 2. And to make a pally with no int, now u taking away what a pally is. A pally is like the heart of the party. The pally takes all the hits so need HP, the pally needs speed and atk and mdef so need Dex and most important pally is last standing and has to save pt, hard to do with no mp. I'm a 265 pally and I hardly need bishop as I heal myself for 4k but danm if I didn't have my 3k mp I'd be screwed. It takes me 1min to go through my mp. I don't understand using a pally improper, to me I think anyone who has changed the build for there pally was impatient and wanted to have a higher DMG before ur pally actually got to shine.I can do up to 21k dmg and I actually use a throwing weapon. Feel free to ask me any questions.
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Post by MiLiGRiTo on Feb 10, 2015 13:46:47 GMT
Well I don't know how anyone would ever think vit/intidex is not a pally tank build. I use this build and there might be like 5 bosses in game I cant solo. With having Dex you gain so much mdef and cast speed its helps keep hate. I use ultimi or litch armor, witch makes me able to use guardian every 2 sec. I don't recall the last time I needed to use voke cause of my speed. My HP is high, 140k just my buffs. I have tanked every boss in game with no problem including sauro 170,Almas,tarna and raton 2. And to make a pally with no int, now u taking away what a pally is. A pally is like the heart of the party. The pally takes all the hits so need HP, the pally needs speed and atk and mdef so need Dex and most important pally is last standing and has to save pt, hard to do with no mp. I'm a 265 pally and I hardly need bishop as I heal myself for 4k but danm if I didn't have my 3k mp I'd be screwed. It takes me 1min to go through my mp. I don't understand using a pally improper, to me I think anyone who has changed the build for there pally was impatient and wanted to have a higher DMG before ur pally actually got to shine.I can do up to 21k dmg and I actually use a throwing weapon. Feel free to ask me any questions. The point of this post Is to prove that vit Is the only requirement to tank. Everything else Is auxillary.
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Post by AnTz on Feb 10, 2015 16:26:59 GMT
Well I don't know how anyone would ever think vit/int/dex is not a pally tank build. I use this build and there might be like 5 bosses in game I cant solo. With having Dex you gain so much mdef and cast speed its helps keep hate. I use ultimi or litch armor, witch makes me able to use guardian every 2 sec. I don't recall the last time I needed to use voke cause of my speed. My HP is high, 140k just my buffs. I have tanked every boss in game with no problem including sauro 170,Almas,tarna and raton 2. And to make a pally with no int, now u taking away what a pally is. A pally is like the heart of the party. The pally takes all the hits so need HP, the pally needs speed and atk and mdef so need Dex and most important pally is last standing and has to save pt, hard to do with no mp. I'm a 265 pally and I hardly need bishop as I heal myself for 4k but danm if I didn't have my 3k mp I'd be screwed. It takes me 1min to go through my mp. I don't understand using a pally improper, to me I think anyone who has changed the build for there pally was impatient and wanted to have a higher DMG before ur pally actually got to shine.I can do up to 21k dmg and I actually use a throwing weapon. Feel free to ask me any questions. Ur opinion doesnt prove anything that pally without int cant tank well. I agree with MiLiGRiTo that ur opinion only proof that what pally need is only max vit. The other stat only as helper n u can choose based on ur gameplay I have try many builds before, vit int dex -> vit dex agi int -> vit int str -> vit int dex again -> vit dex str till now. I dont see any significant difference when im with max int, compared to with no int like now. For a class with 140k+ hp, 1k magic dmg difference is not hurt at all. And finally, about heal, why I must heal myself with 4k heal if one click of onigiri can heal me 14-15k hp XD (my max hp with own buff is 150k)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 21:08:43 GMT
Well I don't know how anyone would ever think vit/int/dex is not a pally tank build. I use this build and there might be like 5 bosses in game I cant solo. With having Dex you gain so much mdef and cast speed its helps keep hate. I use ultimi or litch armor, witch makes me able to use guardian every 2 sec. I don't recall the last time I needed to use voke cause of my speed. My HP is high, 140k just my buffs. I have tanked every boss in game with no problem including sauro 170,Almas,tarna and raton 2. And to make a pally with no int, now u taking away what a pally is. A pally is like the heart of the party. The pally takes all the hits so need HP, the pally needs speed and atk and mdef so need Dex and most important pally is last standing and has to save pt, hard to do with no mp. I'm a 265 pally and I hardly need bishop as I heal myself for 4k but danm if I didn't have my 3k mp I'd be screwed. It takes me 1min to go through my mp. I don't understand using a pally improper, to me I think anyone who has changed the build for there pally was impatient and wanted to have a higher DMG before ur pally actually got to shine.I can do up to 21k dmg and I actually use a throwing weapon. Feel free to ask me any questions. Ur opinion doesnt prove anything that pally without int cant tank well. I agree with MiLiGRiTo that ur opinion only proof that what pally need is only max vit. The other stat only as helper n u can choose based on ur gameplay I have try many builds before, vit int dex -> vit dex agi int -> vit int str -> vit int dex again -> vit dex str till now. I dont see any significant difference when im with max int, compared to with no int like now. For a class with 140k+ hp, 1k magic dmg difference is not hurt at all. And finally, about heal, why I must heal myself with 4k heal if one click of onigiri can heal me 14-15k hp XD (my max hp with own buff is 150k) Certain equipment like Scholar ring provide more stats if your VIT/INT is over 200 giving the user +10% Magic and Physical Resistance, which is reliable for a paladin if they would like to minimize damage as much as possible. Or they can use Mirage Stone which is actually an extremely useful spec equipment as it cuts damage per 50 MP, which is triggered every hit from the enemy from how i've been using it on bosses/mob grinding. It is a player preference yeah for what they would want to use in the end, if you go VIT/INT/DEX style you can switch between spec/magic sword or if you go VIT/DEX/STR you can switch between spec/normal sword, the difference isn't so obsolete to say that others are wrong though lol xD Onigiri is expensive you know haha xD merchants rob me everyday whenever i have to replenish stacks of it xDD
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Post by AnTz on Feb 11, 2015 8:41:33 GMT
Certain equipment like Scholar ring provide more stats if your VIT/INT is over 200 giving the user +10% Magic and Physical Resistance, which is reliable for a paladin if they would like to minimize damage as much as possible. Or they can use Mirage Stone which is actually an extremely useful spec equipment as it cuts damage per 50 MP, which is triggered every hit from the enemy from how i've been using it on bosses/mob grinding. It is a player preference yeah for what they would want to use in the end, if you go VIT/INT/DEX style you can switch between spec/magic sword or if you go VIT/DEX/STR you can switch between spec/normal sword, the difference isn't so obsolete to say that others are wrong though lol xD Onigiri is expensive you know haha xD merchants rob me everyday whenever i have to replenish stacks of it xDD Yeah, Im not said VIT-INT-DEX is bad either. Each build have its own advantage n disadvantage. I just want say that even a VIT-DEX-STR pally can tank well against magic boss. In the end, only max VIT is the significant factor for a paladin, other stat is supplementary only. Onigiri is expensive you know haha xD <--- ikr XD but thats d last way to do (go to npc) if dun wan to farm it first when u need XD Btw where to get Mirage stone? From mob or production?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2015 0:43:10 GMT
Certain equipment like Scholar ring provide more stats if your VIT/INT is over 200 giving the user +10% Magic and Physical Resistance, which is reliable for a paladin if they would like to minimize damage as much as possible. Or they can use Mirage Stone which is actually an extremely useful spec equipment as it cuts damage per 50 MP, which is triggered every hit from the enemy from how i've been using it on bosses/mob grinding. It is a player preference yeah for what they would want to use in the end, if you go VIT/INT/DEX style you can switch between spec/magic sword or if you go VIT/DEX/STR you can switch between spec/normal sword, the difference isn't so obsolete to say that others are wrong though lol xD Onigiri is expensive you know haha xD merchants rob me everyday whenever i have to replenish stacks of it xDD Yeah, Im not said VIT-INT-DEX is bad either. Each build have its own advantage n disadvantage. I just want say that even a VIT-DEX-STR pally can tank well against magic boss. In the end, only max VIT is the significant factor for a paladin, other stat is supplementary only. Onigiri is expensive you know haha xD <--- ikr XD but thats d last way to do (go to npc) if dun wan to farm it first when u need XD Btw where to get Mirage stone? From mob or production? apis from morbeelzom dungeon (dont know if i spelled the name right lol)
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Post by hexan1981 on Feb 12, 2015 14:44:03 GMT
Yeah, Im not said VIT-INT-DEX is bad either. Each build have its own advantage n disadvantage. I just want say that even a VIT-DEX-STR pally can tank well against magic boss. In the end, only max VIT is the significant factor for a paladin, other stat is supplementary only. Onigiri is expensive you know haha xD <--- ikr XD but thats d last way to do (go to npc) if dun wan to farm it first when u need XD Btw where to get Mirage stone? From mob or production? apis from morbeelzom dungeon (dont know if i spelled the name right lol) well heres a shocker dps pally 50k hp but evades so much dps is a little lower then say a ninja but just been in many pts since rowels return and damb i love dps so i tank and do average but fast dmg all gravy (ps unlike ninja stun dont do shiet) lol
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Post by bohant on Feb 17, 2015 2:47:37 GMT
I use to use onigiri but realize so revita ale base heal me for 10k and max heal for 140k
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Post by MiLiGRiTo on Feb 17, 2015 6:19:14 GMT
I use to use onigiri but realize so revita ale base heal me for 10k and max heal for 140k Yeah SP. Rev. Ale is superior but I find it hard to get them (I have to multi device farm it at Mt Mithurna but it still takes time.) With my potions gear I only end up with 108k HP but my Onigiris heal me for 23k HP and 651MP for each remagic L and oftentimes this is enough to solo grind bosses or tank without bishop or hw. I still find it more convenient to buy pots from store since I make more spina from farming rares than farming Sp Rev Ales. When I use my HP set I can pump to around 180kHP but I rarely do that because my Onigiris drop to 18k HP and it is not enough to cover the HP loss from spamming Guardian while taking damage, and remagics drop to 300MP which also burns very fast. With this gear, I end up with no MP because I am too busy spamming Onigiri to stay alive (no time to squeeze remagic L).
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Post by MiLiGRiTo on Feb 17, 2015 6:33:14 GMT
BTW, I think MDEF is pretty significant nowadays with Apostolia out since INT builds can have around 3k MDEF easily (possibly push to 4k). Those numbers are significant enough to make alot of bosses look like wimps.
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Post by bohant on Feb 18, 2015 17:06:25 GMT
I use to use onigiri but realize so revita ale base heal me for 10k and max heal for 140k Yeah SP. Rev. Ale is superior but I find it hard to get them (I have to multi device farm it at Mt Mithurna but it still takes time.) With my potions gear I only end up with 108k HP but my Onigiris heal me for 23k HP and 651MP for each remagic L and oftentimes this is enough to solo grind bosses or tank without bishop or hw. I still find it more convenient to buy pots from store since I make more spina from farming rares than farming Sp Rev Ales. When I use my HP set I can pump to around 180kHP but I rarely do that because my Onigiris drop to 18k HP and it is not enough to cover the HP loss from spamming Guardian while taking damage, and remagics drop to 300MP which also burns very fast. With this gear, I end up with no MP because I am too busy spamming Onigiri to stay alive (no time to squeeze remagic L). You using kaise piltz xtals in HP set? I am thinking about it but curious if its worth the mdef and def loss.. Any opinions? I'd be like 200k HP with them tho
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