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Post by ManaKhe on Dec 8, 2014 6:00:51 GMT
Interesting setup. How much damage do you do to Megas/High Ents/Nommars? I deal, with wind origin at Mega, around 26k. The only bad thing about this set up, in my opinion, (not talking about the xtals, still trying to get another Kaiser2), is the mercure's wind resistance -20%, it hurts a lot so when it comes to wind elemental boss I use Schlacht Helm/Hp+20% (trying to get another matk xtals here too). MiLiGRiTo, those builds x weapons look really good for the damage. But in my opinion, they both have a weak point. The first build with the special sword, I guess it'll boost the Magic Blade's Atk by a lot, but concerning the Matk part, it'll be weak without INT. I never tested that, just saying what I'm thinking. The second build, yup it'll boost thr Atk & Matk, it might be a good build for pure dps, but without VIT I think it'll be hard to survive since we steal aggro easily when we are in a party and if you're soloing, then it might be hard to kill strong bosses (who deals high damage). Yes I know you're talking about dps and I'm talking about survability, but just saying what I think about those 2 new builds. I like the ideas though, I might try them once I get a few Stelfy's Books. I would suggest switching Fuma for Dia Espada UP and Dmail for Ultimi in order to keep your delay down. You should notice a pretty significant increase in damage by doing that. You could also use Excelis UP. For Wind Ele Bosses/Mobs you could switch Mercure with Barbarotita to keep the delay. Alternatively you could use tank equip and switch in Fuma and Ultimi/Licht to keep the delay. Fuma+Licht+Duel Shield is what I use for melee oriented bosses(until I get a quick cool for add xD). I'm almost certain you will notice a big increase by switching to Dia Espada UP over Fuma. You seem to have better xtals(aside from Schlingel) than me and I hit 29k with Wind Origin. My current gear is Dia Espada UP(FG), Glory Cape(Isu), Excelis UP(FG), and Dnewt(Mezza).
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Shiruyui
Member
Take away the lies and become an ace
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Post by Shiruyui on Dec 8, 2014 13:12:54 GMT
Yuppers I tried Dia Esapada up/Kaiser2, Ultimi/Moldus, Mercure/Tarna, Dnewt/Mezza and I deal 30-31k on Mega with Wind Origin. It's a pretty damage °^°)9. For wind elemental bosses, I'll swap Ultimi for Exe up/Magonza, Magonza since all, or almost all my xtals are MATK ones, I'll try a good ATK xtal, and I'll swap Mercure for Glory Cape/Kaiser2 (I haven't tested that set yet, I need a little bit more for my Exe up/Magonza, I got the rest).
As for tank set, I'm using Fuma up/Schlingel (I'll probably replace the lame xtal by a Hp+20% since I'll only be using it for tank set xD), Licht/Hp+20% and Idealsol/Hp+20%. It works really well I could tank WoL in a party at level 225 ish, I don't know if we can all do that at level 220+ but for me it's a huge step haha. Also, when it comes to Fire elemental bosses (still talking about tanking set) I'll switch Idealsol to Schlacht Helm or I can try your Duel Shield o.ob
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Post by ManaKhe on Dec 8, 2014 16:10:22 GMT
Yuppers I tried Dia Esapada up/Kaiser2, Ultimi/Moldus, Mercure/Tarna, Dnewt/Mezza and I deal 30-31k on Mega with Wind Origin. It's a pretty damage °^°)9. For wind elemental bosses, I'll swap Ultimi for Exe up/Magonza, Magonza since all, or almost all my xtals are MATK ones, I'll try a good ATK xtal, and I'll swap Mercure for Glory Cape/Kaiser2 (I haven't tested that set yet, I need a little bit more for my Exe up/Magonza, I got the rest). As for tank set, I'm using Fuma up/Schlingel (I'll probably replace the lame xtal by a Hp+20% since I'll only be using it for tank set xD), Licht/Hp+20% and Idealsol/Hp+20%. It works really well I could tank WoL in a party at level 225 ish, I don't know if we can all do that at level 220+ but for me it's a huge step haha. Also, when it comes to Fire elemental bosses (still talking about tanking set) I'll switch Idealsol to Schlacht Helm or I can try your Duel Shield o.ob Nuuuu stop you do more damage than me now! Lol Jk at least I know about what I will do haha. WoL is one of the harder bosses to tank since he hits pretty hard but he is doable.
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Post by aerisa on Dec 12, 2014 11:40:49 GMT
So, I've have a couple of points..
Firstly, I haven't seen it posted here yet (sorry if it has and I haven't seen it) but you can speed up the cooldown of magic overheat from qadal by sitting down. It goes down by 3% each step as opposed to 1% which still isn't fast by any means but I I figured is worth a mention (mostry because I just got it and am really excited haha!).
Secondly, I feel like the ATK side of magic blade has been overlooked somewhat seeing as it makes up half of the damage. I use dia up/oritius, exe up/moldus, g cape/vida, silver ring/mezza (I accidently sold dragnewt T_T) and hit around 28k without origin and about 32-33k with origin. Origin affects you melee, not your magic and so a higher atk value will mean a larger increase brought about by origin; if don't belive me, fight piton in the Xmas event and select "now I'm serious" - this will massively increase your atk stat - then check your damage with and without wind origin.. The difference is about 20k damage if i remember correctly.
I'm not saying my setup is perfect by any stretch and I'm still tweaking it here and there, but it is incredibly useful to include atk based xtals in your build for both damage and the fact that you'll do more damage to barriers too.
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Post by Tilt*Madara on Dec 12, 2014 12:24:56 GMT
So, I've have a couple of points.. Firstly, I haven't seen it posted here yet (sorry if it has and I haven't seen it) but you can speed up the cooldown of magic overheat from qadal by sitting down. It goes down by 3% each step as opposed to 1% which still isn't fast by any means but I I figured is worth a mention (mostry because I just got it and am really excited haha!). Secondly, I feel like the ATK side of magic blade has been overlooked somewhat seeing as it makes up half of the damage. I use dia up/oritius, exe up/moldus, g cape/vida, silver ring/mezza (I accidently sold dragnewt T_T) and hit around 28k without origin and about 32-33k with origin. Origin affects you melee, not your magic and so a higher atk value will mean a larger increase brought about by origin; if don't belive me, fight piton in the Xmas event and select "now I'm serious" - this will massively increase your atk stat - then check your damage with and without wind origin.. The difference is about 20k damage if i remember correctly. I'm not saying my setup is perfect by any stretch and I'm still tweaking it here and there, but it is incredibly useful to include atk based xtals in your build for both damage and the fact that you'll do more damage to barriers too. Lol if this is true, looks like magic staff could take over once iruna acually releases some decent ones.
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Post by MiLiGRiTo on Dec 13, 2014 0:09:00 GMT
So, I've have a couple of points.. Firstly, I haven't seen it posted here yet (sorry if it has and I haven't sen it) but you can speeit up the cooldown of magic overheat from qadal by sitting down. It goes down by 3% each step as opposed to 1% which still isn't fast by any means but I I figured is worth a mention (mostry because I just got it and am really excited haha!). Secondly, I feel like the ATK side of magic blade has been overlooked somewhat seeing as it makes up half of the damage. I use dia up/oritius, exe up/moldus, g cape/vida, silver ring/mezza (I accidently sold dragnewt T_T) and hit around 28k without origin and about 32-33k with origin. Origin affects you melee, not your magic and so a higher atk value will mean a larger increase brought about by origin; if don't belive me, fight piton in the Xmas event and select "now I'm serious" - this will massively increase your atk stat - then check your damage with and without wind origin.. The difference is about 20k damage if i remember correctly. I'm not saying my setup is perfect by any stretch and I'm still tweaking it here and there, but it is incredibly useful to include atk based xtals in your build for both damage and the fact that you'll do more damage to barriers too. This Is an Interesting observation, thanks for sharing. how much atk and matk you have and what mob you dealt 28k that boosted to 32k origin? we can try to crack the math behind It. With more data we can check the best potential for magic blade, and maybe also check for def penetration. i cant test for myself yet because my chanter Is underleveled.
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Post by aerisa on Dec 13, 2014 12:39:50 GMT
So, I've have a couple of points.. Firstly, I haven't seen it posted here yet (sorry if it has and I haven't sen it) but you can speeit up the cooldown of magic overheat from qadal by sitting down. It goes down by 3% each step as opposed to 1% which still isn't fast by any means but I I figured is worth a mention (mostry because I just got it and am really excited haha!). Secondly, I feel like the ATK side of magic blade has been overlooked somewhat seeing as it makes up half of the damage. I use dia up/oritius, exe up/moldus, g cape/vida, silver ring/mezza (I accidently sold dragnewt T_T) and hit around 28k without origin and about 32-33k with origin. Origin affects you melee, not your magic and so a higher atk value will mean a larger increase brought about by origin; if don't belive me, fight piton in the Xmas event and select "now I'm serious" - this will massively increase your atk stat - then check your damage with and without wind origin.. The difference is about 20k damage if i remember correctly. I'm not saying my setup is perfect by any stretch and I'm still tweaking it here and there, but it is incredibly useful to include atk based xtals in your build for both damage and the fact that you'll do more damage to barriers too. This Is an Interesting observation, thanks for sharing. how much atk and matk you have and what mob you dealt 28k that boosted to 32k origin? we can try to crack the math behind It. With more data we can check the best potential for magic blade, and maybe also check for def penetration. i cant test for myself yet because my chanter Is underleveled. Ermm, I think I sit at about 2k atk and 2.2k matk. The damage was done at nommar - whether that translates to megas which seem to be the standard here, I don't know. Yeah, it seems that barriers are easier to penetrate from a physical perspective rather than magical. I'm currently holding off on getting abilities until the physical and magical penetration ones are released as I feel theyll be most beneficial to magic blade.
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Post by tookoozv on Dec 13, 2014 20:46:52 GMT
I'm surpise why so many experiences chanter here kept saying "ORIGIN DOES NOT EFFECT MAGIC DMGES". Well FYI, I've TESTED it and it DOES raise mattk.
Also here's a prove from jp wiki . *I capitalize it* (
(Way to increase the target attribute attack, the defense. Change attributes that increase in the level you want to use. Lv1 (fire), Lv2 (water), Lv3 (wind), Lv4 (h) SLv1 ~ 4 MP160 Quest [skill acquisition trial!] (Lv180) clear (duration 2 minutes) Lv1 (fire) Fire attribute physical attack damage, fire attribute defense increase, FIRE ATTRIBUTE MAGIC ATTACK POWER INCREASE
Lv2 (water) water attribute physical attack damage and water attribute defense increase, WATER ATTRIBUTE MAGIC ATTACK POWER INCREASE
Lv3 (wind) wind attribute physical attack damage, wind attribute defense increase, WIND ATTRIBUTE MAGIC ATTACK POWER INCREASE
Lv4 (h) land attribute physical attack damage location attribute defense increase, LAND ATTRIBUTE MAGIC ATTACK POWER INCREASE)
AND.. If YALL noticed ,recently there's new EQ and XTALS with *+ % magic power to elements: Fire ,water ,wind, earth* stat. This is when it come in place to raise ur elemental magic power .
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Post by ManaKhe on Dec 13, 2014 22:21:27 GMT
I'm surpise why so many experiences chanter here kept saying "ORIGIN DOES NOT EFFECT MAGIC DMGES". Well FYI, I've TESTED it and it DOES raise mattk. Also here's a prove from jp wiki . *I capitalize it* ( (Way to increase the target attribute attack, the defense. Change attributes that increase in the level you want to use. Lv1 (fire), Lv2 (water), Lv3 (wind), Lv4 (h) SLv1 ~ 4 MP160 Quest [skill acquisition trial!] (Lv180) clear (duration 2 minutes) Lv1 (fire) Fire attribute physical attack damage, fire attribute defense increase, FIRE ATTRIBUTE MAGIC ATTACK POWER INCREASE Lv2 (water) water attribute physical attack damage and water attribute defense increase, WATER ATTRIBUTE MAGIC ATTACK POWER INCREASE Lv3 (wind) wind attribute physical attack damage, wind attribute defense increase, WIND ATTRIBUTE MAGIC ATTACK POWER INCREASE Lv4 (h) land attribute physical attack damage location attribute defense increase, LAND ATTRIBUTE MAGIC ATTACK POWER INCREASE) AND.. If YALL noticed ,recently there's new EQ and XTALS with *+ % magic power to elements: Fire ,water ,wind, earth* stat. This is when it come in place to raise ur elemental magic power . Origin does indeed increase magic damage. It increases Water, Wind, Earth, or Fire magic damage. I've never heard anyone say different lol. Magic Blade magic hit is neutral magic though and is unaffected by Origin. The physical part it though.
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Post by ManaKhe on Dec 13, 2014 22:27:43 GMT
This Is an Interesting observation, thanks for sharing. how much atk and matk you have and what mob you dealt 28k that boosted to 32k origin? we can try to crack the math behind It. With more data we can check the best potential for magic blade, and maybe also check for def penetration. i cant test for myself yet because my chanter Is underleveled. Ermm, I think I sit at about 2k atk and 2.2k matk. The damage was done at nommar - whether that translates to megas which seem to be the standard here, I don't know. Yeah, it seems that barriers are easier to penetrate from a physical perspective rather than magical. I'm currently holding off on getting abilities until the physical and magical penetration ones are released as I feel theyll be most beneficial to magic blade. Nommars have much lower Def and Mdef values than Megaroches. My damage on them is 29k without origin and 33k with it. So it is very similar. However my xtals aren't optimal like Shiruyui's. She would probably be hitting 31k and 35k to Nommars give or take 1k.
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Post by aerisa on Dec 14, 2014 13:17:45 GMT
Ermm, I think I sit at about 2k atk and 2.2k matk. The damage was done at nommar - whether that translates to megas which seem to be the standard here, I don't know. Yeah, it seems that barriers are easier to penetrate from a physical perspective rather than magical. I'm currently holding off on getting abilities until the physical and magical penetration ones are released as I feel theyll be most beneficial to magic blade. Nommars have much lower Def and Mdef values than Megaroches. My damage on them is 29k without origin and 33k with it. So it is very similar. However my xtals aren't optimal like Shiruyui's. She would probably be hitting 31k and 35k to Nommars give or take 1k. Ahh, my bad - I haven't been to megas for a fair while heheh Nonetheless I stand by my point that atk shouldn't be overlooked, though im in no way saying that maximizing your matk is a bad thing.. I just wanted to share my way heheh
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Post by aerisa on Dec 14, 2014 13:32:16 GMT
Going back to qadal - I've been playing about with it and found some stuff that I can't quite get my head around.. The magic attack itself is neutral and so is increased quite significantly by dia up, however using dia up increases the magic overheat by almost 40% each time whereas simply switching to Fuma II makes it go up by around 20%. Also, I've noticed that the damage done by the magic attack is greater when used from a higher magic overheat, or used so that it leaves you at a high magic overheat (one of those, not sure which) - ie. From 0% MO it hits around 17-18k, whereas when used from 50% MO will hit around 40k. Obviously this damage is also further increased if used while in the special state. I haven't actually looked at my stats while in the special state (which I probably shouldve done), but it seems that the stat increases are also dependent on the starting/resultant magic overheat (I noticed this from magic blade damage following using qadal at varying MO values). Finally, though I haven't thoroughly tested it yet, it doesn't seem like the magic attack from this spell is piercing to boss barriers - obviously I will look into this more but this is my current finding.
Sorry for the long post, I just think it's a really interesting albeit frustrating skill which could hold a few secrets for us xD
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Post by MiLiGRiTo on Dec 15, 2014 2:19:20 GMT
This Is an Interesting observation, thanks for sharing. how much atk and matk you have and what mob you dealt 28k that boosted to 32k origin? we can try to crack the math behind It. With more data we can check the best potential for magic blade, and maybe also check for def penetration. i cant test for myself yet because my chanter Is underleveled. Ermm, I think I sit at about 2k atk and 2.2k matk. The damage was done at nommar - whether that translates to megas which seem to be the standard here, I don't know. Yeah, it seems that barriers are easier to penetrate from a physical perspective rather than magical. I'm currently holding off on getting abilities until the physical and magical penetration ones are released as I feel theyll be most beneficial to magic blade. If Origin adds 20% elemental damage, and it only affects the ATK part, and you get 4k more damage from it (32k - 28k = 4k), then 4k / 20% = 20k dmg comes from ATK 28k - 20k = 8k comes from the MATK. Revalidate: 20k ATK + 20% = 24k + 8k = 32k damage with origin. Pretty big bias for ATK. You might want to drop MATK xtals and go full ATK. We need more data to see how much ATK adds how much damage and how much MATK adds how much damage. If you could spellboost from your current gear, fighting the same mob, we can check the effect of MATK in this equation.
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Post by AnTz on Dec 15, 2014 5:31:08 GMT
Ermm, I think I sit at about 2k atk and 2.2k matk. The damage was done at nommar - whether that translates to megas which seem to be the standard here, I don't know. Yeah, it seems that barriers are easier to penetrate from a physical perspective rather than magical. I'm currently holding off on getting abilities until the physical and magical penetration ones are released as I feel theyll be most beneficial to magic blade. If Origin adds 20% elemental damage, and it only affects the ATK part, and you get 4k more damage from it (32k - 28k = 4k), then 4k / 20% = 20k dmg comes from ATK 28k - 20k = 8k comes from the MATK. Revalidate: 20k ATK + 20% = 24k + 8k = 32k damage with origin. Pretty big bias for ATK. You might want to drop MATK xtals and go full ATK. We need more data to see how much ATK adds how much damage and how much MATK adds how much damage. If you could spellboost from your current gear, fighting the same mob, we can check the effect of MATK in this equation. Let say, if physical dmg part is equal with the magic part (since we dun hav the calculation so I assume like this), mean the damage output will depend to atk+%/ melee+% & matk+%/ magic+% that u put in ur gears. If that the case, use niapa/ tothras/ nero/ capt beelzed/ sakimori at additional will giv u the highest boost (+15% melee). It only slightly loose to Tarna (+15% matk, magic+400) n better than dunkelis (+13% matk). Those melee element xtals + origin will be a nice combo
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Post by ManaKhe on Dec 15, 2014 8:46:44 GMT
Ermm, I think I sit at about 2k atk and 2.2k matk. The damage was done at nommar - whether that translates to megas which seem to be the standard here, I don't know. Yeah, it seems that barriers are easier to penetrate from a physical perspective rather than magical. I'm currently holding off on getting abilities until the physical and magical penetration ones are released as I feel theyll be most beneficial to magic blade. If Origin adds 20% elemental damage, and it only affects the ATK part, and you get 4k more damage from it (32k - 28k = 4k), then 4k / 20% = 20k dmg comes from ATK 28k - 20k = 8k comes from the MATK. Revalidate: 20k ATK + 20% = 24k + 8k = 32k damage with origin. Pretty big bias for ATK. You might want to drop MATK xtals and go full ATK. We need more data to see how much ATK adds how much damage and how much MATK adds how much damage. If you could spellboost from your current gear, fighting the same mob, we can check the effect of MATK in this equation. It's 25% not 20%. Origin also screws with the RNG and you can make yourself hit higher with it. I hit 32-33k but I usually just use origin again to get myself to hit 33k every time. It's weird lol. Before Origin I hit 12-13k and 17k, after its 15-16k and 17k. The thing about switching to ATK xtals over MATK ones is that i have 50% MATK in xtals alone. It will probably drop my magic damage by about 7-8k. I would have to make up for that in ATK xtals which would be very close if it succeeded. I also would be able to get 9% more MATK over the xtals I currently have. It's mostly only because MATK xtals just get so much more MATK than ATK can get. If it were more even ATK would be better. Also nearly everything in the game has more MDEF than DEF so you gotta take that into consideration when determining how much MATK increase damage. You will usually use the same element as a boss too so the benefit from Origin won't apply on them.
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