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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 15, 2016 14:24:27 GMT
Actually on the topic of enchy skills (really think about making enchy now lol)
Does enchy do that skill delay skill (Quick)?
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Post by Crysta|'s hubby on Dec 15, 2016 14:56:06 GMT
No it doesn't do that skill on your earlier points enchanters heal is kind of irrelevant since glad can use veltria and its not like enchanters heal does 1k+ without heal +gear have you ever tried stone skin buff from an ench?on other people it lasts 30 seconds only and is so easy to break through you'd have to spam it for it to make a difference making the ench basically a skin slave you got me on the mp heal I admit but autoskill buff is only really useless for single target grind pt and the reflect skill kind of gets trumped by cross counter also pillar can be weaker than mblade but is mblade aoe? No it is not also I see you continue to go about the hypocrisy of judging other classes without having a 300+ whilst judging others on doing the same and I see that you are unwilling to accept anything that doesn't fit into your point since you keep changing your story are you complaining glad is the worst tank?if so you've been proven wrong are you claiming it has the lowest dps?if so you've been proven wrong are you complaining you can't get a pt?bk monk servant and even enchanter have issues there as well bosses don't matter as much for glad?then switch to pillar spam for mobs. Then it takes longer to kill bosses? Oh but didn't they not matter?then stop complaining and wait to see what happens with the skills I agree they need to be buffed I agree gladiator needs work done on it I agree gladiator is hard to lvl and mq but its not as bad as you make it out to be and you can't retort by saying "oh you don't know the struggles you don't have a 300+ glad" you don't have a 300+ of any of the classes you are comparing it to yourself now do you? If you're free to judge on other classes based on what you've seen everyone else is allowed to do the same
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Post by ManaKhe on Dec 15, 2016 15:06:05 GMT
Pls don't say something like M.Blade is similar as other class "active attack" skill. It's completely different, why? BCS M.Blade can never out damage Ench's Auto Attack. Meanwhile, other class "active attack" skill such as Samurai skill, can out damage their Auto Attack. Samurai vs Almas. Can M.Blade do the same thing like that Samurai Skill?? Play the role as finishing move before Almas debuff your skill? Surely no, and it's impossible. (Why I compare this M.Blade with other Class skill, bcs Enchanter "main" damage dealer skill is only Magic Blade. Illness hit only usefull when you are in Ailment mode, meanwhile qadal skill delay is a mehhhh....) What does this means? The answer is different from many Ench. But if you ask me, I'll say that M.Blade isn't mean to be the main source of damage for Enchanter. It's a secondary way to deal a damage so It's just a second option. Morever, M.Blade spammer who use TANK Equipment has lower M.Blade Damage. And I bet It's less than 50k. In fact, M.Blade spammer who use TANK equipment can only have damage +-50k with spell boost which means, their TANK capabilities become lower bcs of spell boost downside stats. Meanwhile, Other "KNIGHT" Decendant Class in TANK mode has a higher damage. So, M.Blade is completely not similar with gladi tempest. Even M.Blade lvl2 can't out damage tempest. If you don't believe me, then try searching any random gladi solo boss video, maybe Osieta Girl video. Then bring your enchanter and try solo the same boss with only using M.Blade. Let us see, can you defeat that boss faster than Osieta Girl's Gladiator??? (I'll choose Sauro 350 for this challenge, bcs this boss force both Gladiator and Enchanter to use their Tank Equipment, If they don't use their Tank Equipment, They will surely got beaten so badly by that Old Man.) I'm Magic Blade spammer and I hit about 50k with M.Blade in tank gear without spell boost. Of course I've made sure most of my DPS gear is kinda tanky as well xD. Haven't tried soloing Sauro 350 tough haha. I'm also only level 290 so I'm sure I wouldn't compare to a capped Gladi xD.
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Post by ManaKhe on Dec 15, 2016 15:07:41 GMT
Actually on the topic of enchy skills (really think about making enchy now lol) Does enchy do that skill delay skill (Quick)? That's Bishop. Enchanter buffs are Draw, Enchant, Fire/Water/Earth/Wind Element(used to just be Elemental Attack), Defense, and Reflect.
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Post by Arata on Dec 15, 2016 15:52:23 GMT
Read again my last post. This part. ""I told you about this bcs I don't want other player who don't know about Enchanter will think that M.Blade works the same as Other Class Active Attack skill. Bcs if they think like that, they will get disappointed when they realize, M.Blade damage is not as high as they think. So, eventho Echanter got M.Blade lvl 2, it's not something that will make you feels wow. Bcs as I said, It's not the main source of damage for Enchanter. This is my reason to burst in. My other reason is, you want Gladiator to get tempest lv2 "SAME" as M.Blade lv2 Enchanter as If Tempest is the same thing as M.Blade, while tempest lv1 can outdamage M.Blade lv2 Enchanter. If you didn't mention M.Blade level2 or comparing it with Gladiator skill in your previous post, I will not post this here."" I don't have an issues about your reason why gladiator falls behind other class. I only want to correct your view about Magic Blade. It can mislead other player. So that's why I corrected it and explained it why Magic Blade is "inferior skill" when you compare it with gladiator tempest/pillar. I'll go ahead and admit that mblade doesn't work as well on tempest on bosses... But that still only makes gladi stronger on boss damage than one class... Only on bosses... And that does make bosses easier for gladi..not even every boss, enchy can solo magic bosses much better than us. I went to Iruna and re-confirm it, using magic blade on normal mobs (that have the same element as origin) and using magic blade on bosses. I compare my magic blade damage on Baum Warrior with Tora's damage on this video: (only found this old videos, and I can't find any other recent Gladiator grinding videos). I have a higher magic blade damage than Tora with spellboost and fire origin. Using the same equipment, I tried fighting ouvel to compare it with this Gladiator: I have less damage than her. Got 100k+ damage with spell boost and ouvel killed me half way after it stunts me. Can't survive with all out matk equipment. So, yes, you're totally right. Magic Blade works better on normal mobs, and it doesn't work as good as Gladiator skill on boss field. Other information, my Magic Blade Damage got reduced by +60k when I tried it on Yarde using the same equipment and spell boost. And I don't know about Gladiator damage on Yarde. Can they have the same damage as before (when fighting Baum) or their damage also got reduced when fighting Yarde? I can't find any relevant videos on Youtube bcs most of them are Boss fighting videos including JP Gladiator. If their damage on Yarde is still the same with when fighting Baum Warrior, than I gotta revise that sentence with this one. "Magic Blade works better on normal mobs that have fire/water/wind/earth element"
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 15, 2016 16:38:22 GMT
No it doesn't do that skill on your earlier points enchanters heal is kind of irrelevant since glad can use veltria and its not like enchanters heal does 1k+ without heal +gear have you ever tried stone skin buff from an ench?on other people it lasts 30 seconds only and is so easy to break through you'd have to spam it for it to make a difference making the ench basically a skin slave you got me on the mp heal I admit but autoskill buff is only really useless for single target grind pt and the reflect skill kind of gets trumped by cross counter also pillar can be weaker than mblade but is mblade aoe? No it is not also I see you continue to go about the hypocrisy of judging other classes without having a 300+ whilst judging others on doing the same and I see that you are unwilling to accept anything that doesn't fit into your point since you keep changing your story are you complaining glad is the worst tank?if so you've been proven wrong are you claiming it has the lowest dps?if so you've been proven wrong are you complaining you can't get a pt?bk monk servant and even enchanter have issues there as well bosses don't matter as much for glad?then switch to pillar spam for mobs. Then it takes longer to kill bosses? Oh but didn't they not matter?then stop complaining and wait to see what happens with the skills I agree they need to be buffed I agree gladiator needs work done on it I agree gladiator is hard to lvl and mq but its not as bad as you make it out to be and you can't retort by saying "oh you don't know the struggles you don't have a 300+ glad" you don't have a 300+ of any of the classes you are comparing it to yourself now do you? If you're free to judge on other classes based on what you've seen everyone else is allowed to do the same Im not gonna reply to all this because its too squashed together and it hurts my eyes to read all this without some spaces and some paragraphs. I will however answer the last bit, i make judgement on my class based on what i have seen from other classes... Im not judgeing other classes based on what i jave seen from them. There is a big difference between passing judgement on myself based on what i have seen from others and passing judgement on others with no experience in the matter myself. The reason i can do this is because i own a gladiator so im allowed to judge it. I don't go around making judgement on other classes based on what i have seen from them. I am jugeing my own class based on what i have seen from others. This is a huge difference and its the fundamental difference between ignorance and prudence.
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 15, 2016 16:39:28 GMT
I'll go ahead and admit that mblade doesn't work as well on tempest on bosses... But that still only makes gladi stronger on boss damage than one class... Only on bosses... And that does make bosses easier for gladi..not even every boss, enchy can solo magic bosses much better than us. I went to Iruna and confirm it, using magic blade on normal mobs (that have the same element as origin) and using magic blade on bosses. I compare my magic blade damage on Baum Warrior with Tora's damage on this video: (only found this old videos, and I can't find any other recent Gladiator grinding videos). I have a higher magic blade damage than Tora with spellboost and fire origin. Using the same equipment, I tried fighting ouvel to compare it with this Gladiator: I have less damage than her. Got 100k+ damage with spell boost and ouvel killed me half way after it stunts me. Can't survive with all out matk equipment. So, yes, you're totally right. Magic Blade works better on normal mobs, and it doesn't work as good as Gladiator skill on boss field. Other information, my Magic Blade Damage got reduced by +60k when I tried it on Yarde using the same equipment and spell boost. And I don't know about Gladiator damage on Yarde. Can they have the same damage as before (when fighting Baum) or their damage also got reduced when fighting Yarde? I can't find any relevant videos on Youtube bcs most of them are Boss fighting videos including JP Gladiator. If their damage on Yarde is still the same with when fighting Baum Warrior, than I gotta revise that sentence with this one. "Magic Blade works better on normal mobs that have fire/water/wind/earth element" Great post thank you. Pm me and we can meet in game today to do yarde test if you want too?
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 15, 2016 16:42:19 GMT
Actually on the topic of enchy skills (really think about making enchy now lol) Does enchy do that skill delay skill (Quick)? That's Bishop. Enchanter buffs are Draw, Enchant, Fire/Water/Earth/Wind Element(used to just be Elemental Attack), Defense, and Reflect. Is jn minstrel then? im really sure that i got a quick buff from someone in my pt one time and there was no bishop... Can bishop do quick on none party ppl? I was so confused because i got delay out of nowhere with monk enchy and minstrel in pt... Lol I did also look on enchy skills but couldn't see it so yeah...
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bravebor
Community Contributor
to slack to give a damn, yet to bored to not say anything...
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Post by bravebor on Dec 15, 2016 16:44:22 GMT
No it doesn't do that skill on your earlier points enchanters heal is kind of irrelevant since glad can use veltria and its not like enchanters heal does 1k+ without heal +gear have you ever tried stone skin buff from an ench?on other people it lasts 30 seconds only and is so easy to break through you'd have to spam it for it to make a difference making the ench basically a skin slave you got me on the mp heal I admit but autoskill buff is only really useless for single target grind pt and the reflect skill kind of gets trumped by cross counter also pillar can be weaker than mblade but is mblade aoe? No it is not also I see you continue to go about the hypocrisy of judging other classes without having a 300+ whilst judging others on doing the same and I see that you are unwilling to accept anything that doesn't fit into your point since you keep changing your story are you complaining glad is the worst tank?if so you've been proven wrong are you claiming it has the lowest dps?if so you've been proven wrong are you complaining you can't get a pt?bk monk servant and even enchanter have issues there as well bosses don't matter as much for glad?then switch to pillar spam for mobs. Then it takes longer to kill bosses? Oh but didn't they not matter?then stop complaining and wait to see what happens with the skills I agree they need to be buffed I agree gladiator needs work done on it I agree gladiator is hard to lvl and mq but its not as bad as you make it out to be and you can't retort by saying "oh you don't know the struggles you don't have a 300+ glad" you don't have a 300+ of any of the classes you are comparing it to yourself now do you? If you're free to judge on other classes based on what you've seen everyone else is allowed to do the same Im not gonna reply to all this because its too squashed together and it hurts my eyes to read all this without some spaces and some paragraphs. I will however answer the last bit, i make judgement on my class based on what i have seen from other classes... Im not judgeing other classes based on what i jave seen from them. There is a big difference between passing judgement on myself based on what i have seen from others and passing judgement on others with no experience in the matter myself. The reason i can do this is because i own a gladiator so im allowed to judge it. I don't go around making judgement on other classes based on what i have seen from them. I am jugeing my own class based on what i have seen from others. This is a huge difference and its the fundamental difference between ignorance and prudence. Still kinda judging in saying x class does x better when you havent 1 yourself so dont realise the pitfalls of what it is you are talking up so much as you try to use it for an example to say how bad glad has it...
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 15, 2016 17:07:35 GMT
Im not gonna reply to all this because its too squashed together and it hurts my eyes to read all this without some spaces and some paragraphs. I will however answer the last bit, i make judgement on my class based on what i have seen from other classes... Im not judgeing other classes based on what i jave seen from them. There is a big difference between passing judgement on myself based on what i have seen from others and passing judgement on others with no experience in the matter myself. The reason i can do this is because i own a gladiator so im allowed to judge it. I don't go around making judgement on other classes based on what i have seen from them. I am jugeing my own class based on what i have seen from others. This is a huge difference and its the fundamental difference between ignorance and prudence. Still kinda judging in saying x class does x better when you havent 1 yourself so dont realise the pitfalls of what it is you are talking up so much as you try to use it for an example to say how bad glad has it... Lol the difference is that i never denied that other classes dont have pitfalls... And im not ignorant enough to deny that they do. What i am pointing out is the pitfalls that accompany gladiator are much bigger based on the strengths of other classes. I can only judge my class against what i seen from others. Let me tell you what i have seen from others: More damage More party value Just as good tanking ability. I don't know what the pitfalls of attaining those benefits are but i can clearly see the benefits of that far outweighs the benefits of being a gladiator. BECAUSE IF IT DIDN'T DONT YOU THINK THERE WOULD BE MORE GLADIATOR IN GAME??? If i find out that making a pure tank assassin (somehow) would lower their back stab to less than 10k. I would agree that is a huge pitfall and it wouldn't be wirth attempting to make a tank assassin. I won't compare the tank assassin hitting less than 10k dmg to my own class because i dont own a tank assassin.
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bravebor
Community Contributor
to slack to give a damn, yet to bored to not say anything...
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Post by bravebor on Dec 15, 2016 17:20:03 GMT
Still kinda judging in saying x class does x better when you havent 1 yourself so dont realise the pitfalls of what it is you are talking up so much as you try to use it for an example to say how bad glad has it... Lol the difference is that i never denied that other classes dont have pitfalls... And im not ignorant enough to deny that they do. What i am pointing out is the pitfalls that accompany gladiator are much bigger based on the strengths of other classes. I can only judge my class against what i seen from others. Let me tell you what i have seen from others: More damage More party value Just as good tanking ability. I don't know what the pitfalls of attaining those benefits are but i can clearly see the benefits of that far outweighs the benefits of being a gladiator. BECAUSE IF IT DIDN'T DONT YOU THINK THERE WOULD BE MORE GLADIATOR IN GAME??? If i find out that making a pure tank assassin (somehow) would lower their back stab to less than 10k. I would agree that is a huge pitfall and it wouldn't be wirth attempting to make a tank assassin. I won't compare the tank assassin hitting less than 10k dmg to my own class because i dont own a tank assassin. I think the best example I can give (again pally lol) is oath that you have referenced a number of times yet each time you have used it as a reference you fail to mention that it is to start with most effective on bosses that can be 1hit ko, others that require a second or 3rd oath pose a high degree of risk which is multiplied several times when there is someone in pt with you. Ailment in the last fraction of a sec before it triggers and you are screwed. For use on mobs,theres is always downtime between uses,it could be spammed 2, maybe 3 times,then there is the rebuffs and equip change and the times you forget that damned pet that just got pied up and leaves you stunned with 1 hp remaining (I'll tag Yazmat to clarify on this point) so to use it as a measure of how lacking glad skills are just simply doesnt match the point you are trying to make. Not to mention also that those 2.5m oaths are when hp is at its lowest,1 solid crt or hp% hit and pal is screwed. I think overall glad has it better. Even Eaysley said his glad performed better overal than his pal regardless how fun oath was to use.
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 15, 2016 17:40:08 GMT
Lol the difference is that i never denied that other classes dont have pitfalls... And im not ignorant enough to deny that they do. What i am pointing out is the pitfalls that accompany gladiator are much bigger based on the strengths of other classes. I can only judge my class against what i seen from others. Let me tell you what i have seen from others: More damage More party value Just as good tanking ability. I don't know what the pitfalls of attaining those benefits are but i can clearly see the benefits of that far outweighs the benefits of being a gladiator. BECAUSE IF IT DIDN'T DONT YOU THINK THERE WOULD BE MORE GLADIATOR IN GAME??? If i find out that making a pure tank assassin (somehow) would lower their back stab to less than 10k. I would agree that is a huge pitfall and it wouldn't be wirth attempting to make a tank assassin. I won't compare the tank assassin hitting less than 10k dmg to my own class because i dont own a tank assassin. I think the best example I can give (again pally lol) is oath that you have referenced a number of times yet each time you have used it as a reference you fail to mention that it is to start with most effective on bosses that can be 1hit ko, others that require a second or 3rd oath pose a high degree of risk which is multiplied several times when there is someone in pt with you. Ailment in the last fraction of a sec before it triggers and you are screwed. For use on mobs,theres is always downtime between uses,it could be spammed 2, maybe 3 times,then there is the rebuffs and equip change and the times you forget that damned pet that just got pied up and leaves you stunned with 1 hp remaining (I'll tag Yazmat to clarify on this point) so to use it as a measure of how lacking glad skills are just simply doesnt match the point you are trying to make. Not to mention also that those 2.5m oaths are when hp is at its lowest,1 solid crt or hp% hit and pal is screwed. I think overall glad has it better. Even Eaysley said his glad performed better overal than his pal regardless how fun oath was to use. Yeah tbh i won't deny that paladin seems a bit sht, i haven't missed the very important and annoying point that pally needs high vit, and bosses do vit dmg. Almost like they made new bosses badly anti pally. I do generally realize that pally in some ways has to worse than gladiator when it comes to damage. BUT.......... this next part proves you haven't read anything else I've written on this forum and your fixated on paladin... Lets take a look at paladin party value and their skills they can use that can benefit others. I guess thats why pally is more popular, it has much more uses in party than gladiator does. Guess what the best party about that is? Iruna is a party based game lol
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bravebor
Community Contributor
to slack to give a damn, yet to bored to not say anything...
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Post by bravebor on Dec 15, 2016 17:51:39 GMT
I think the best example I can give (again pally lol) is oath that you have referenced a number of times yet each time you have used it as a reference you fail to mention that it is to start with most effective on bosses that can be 1hit ko, others that require a second or 3rd oath pose a high degree of risk which is multiplied several times when there is someone in pt with you. Ailment in the last fraction of a sec before it triggers and you are screwed. For use on mobs,theres is always downtime between uses,it could be spammed 2, maybe 3 times,then there is the rebuffs and equip change and the times you forget that damned pet that just got pied up and leaves you stunned with 1 hp remaining (I'll tag Yazmat to clarify on this point) so to use it as a measure of how lacking glad skills are just simply doesnt match the point you are trying to make. Not to mention also that those 2.5m oaths are when hp is at its lowest,1 solid crt or hp% hit and pal is screwed. I think overall glad has it better. Even Eaysley said his glad performed better overal than his pal regardless how fun oath was to use. Yeah tbh i won't deny that paladin seems a bit sht, i haven't missed the very important and annoying point that pally needs high vit, and bosses do vit dmg. Almost like they made new bosses badly anti pally. I do generally realize that pally in some ways has to worse than gladiator when it comes to damage. BUT.......... this next part proves you haven't read anything else I've written on this forum and your fixated on paladin... Lets take a look at paladin party value and their skills they can use that can benefit others. I guess thats why pally is more popular, it has much more uses in party than gladiator does. Guess what tge best party aboutbthat is? Iruna is a party based game lol Today I was grinding on yardes and intermittently shouting lfp 236 pal. No pt. Yesterday the same. The day before the same etc. Post oath... Why pt when you can 1 hit 3-4 trade or 3is at a time. Maybe a bish or preferably a sevent, but that's it. Sure for boss pts pal are favored, but I think many pals rather solo or just pt with bish or sniper for ailments t heal as any other class poses such a massive liability when casting oath that it is just simply not worth it in the end. Sure oath works awsomly on massively high HP bosses in that during those 10 sec, hate gauge raises massively keeping the mobs attention on you and basically leaving a finishing blow for you by the time it activates once pt members have done their bit. But that is provided that everyone in pt knows what tf they are doing. In terms of pting random ppl, sure an oath pal would be a wanted commodity, but honestly, just how many oath pals pt random people after the first few times of being killed because their pt member had ailments t or was killed at the wrong time... Pallies are awesome tanks, but only for those who understand how to use them as such. Which aren't many. Otherwise, we just keep on fap- *cough* playing with ourselves...
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 15, 2016 18:00:16 GMT
Yeah tbh i won't deny that paladin seems a bit sht, i haven't missed the very important and annoying point that pally needs high vit, and bosses do vit dmg. Almost like they made new bosses badly anti pally. I do generally realize that pally in some ways has to worse than gladiator when it comes to damage. BUT.......... this next part proves you haven't read anything else I've written on this forum and your fixated on paladin... Lets take a look at paladin party value and their skills they can use that can benefit others. I guess thats why pally is more popular, it has much more uses in party than gladiator does. Guess what tge best party aboutbthat is? Iruna is a party based game lol Today I was grinding on yardes and intermittently shouting lfp 236 pal. No pt. Yesterday the same. The day before the same etc. Post oath... Why pt when you can 1 hit 3-4 trade or 3is at a time. Maybe a bish or preferably a sevent, but that's it. Sure for boss pts pal are favored, but I think many pals rather solo or just pt with bish or sniper for ailments t heal as any other class poses such a massive liability when casting oath that it is just simply not worth it in the end. Sure oath works awsomly on massively high HP bosses in that during those 10 sec, hate gauge raises massively keeping the mobs attention on you and basically leaving a finishing blow for you by the time it activates once pt members have done their bit. But that is provided that everyone in pt knows what tf they are doing. In terms of pting random ppl, sure an oath pal would be a wanted commodity, but honestly, just how many oath pals pt random people after the first few times of being killed because their pt member had ailments t or was killed at the wrong time... Pallies are awesome tanks, but only for those who understand how to use them as such. Which aren't many. Otherwise, we just keep on fap- *cough* playing with ourselves... Bro your point just doesn't work. Mq takes you to 251, and any pally who gets to 251 would grind 9 lvls to get oath. Using such a low level pally doesn't prove anything, no level 230 something class could out dmg or out perform a max level gladiator. No chance. I would never suggest they could. But i am talking about top of the game max level best gear players. You just need to ask yourself one thing bro... Do you ever see... Lfm gladi? Because i certainly see "lfm pally"... Dont look at one aspect but look at the class as a whole... Every aspect of it... Not just damage but other aspects... You will find that no matter how you spin things at this stage a max level paladin with top level gear will out perform a max level gladiator with top level gear.
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 15, 2016 18:04:49 GMT
But guys i wont deny benefits to my class. Im the only person i know that can solo whale without dying (aside from another max gladiator). I guess enchy could too? i need another enchy friend ... My enchy friend gone inactive
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