badeko
Member
down w the army of darkness!!
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Post by badeko on Apr 15, 2014 12:46:12 GMT
Also another small note. Why are we all on the topic of being afk while playn. Imo if u gonna be afk while onlind press the home button, iruna is not what shud b playn, clash of the clans is whrre u belong xD..
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Senpai
Community Contributor
meme ni naritai
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Post by Senpai on Apr 15, 2014 14:00:40 GMT
Also another small note. Why are we all on the topic of being afk while playn. Imo if u gonna be afk while onlind press the home button, iruna is not what shud b playn, clash of the clans is whrre u belong xD.. eww, just no.
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badeko
Member
down w the army of darkness!!
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Post by badeko on Apr 15, 2014 14:06:13 GMT
Exactly ewww afk play style x.x
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Post by mohouko on Apr 15, 2014 14:37:38 GMT
Dia espada @163(+9) s/shojo vs leddle colon casting fire spear w fire origin (highest dmg 7375) Resty rod@173(+8) s/shojo vs leee colon casting fire spear w fire orgin (highest dmg 8k+) Same weaps but with added autoskill buff ,meleeing : results are the same Same weaps w added enchant buff, meleeing : results are practically the same Resty rod s/shojo @173+8> Dia espada 163+9 s/shojo I used dpr up s/shojo and divergent sword s/isu and lotus seed ns to test this. What's your build? Also, I'm about to upgrade my Hexe Espada to Dia espada, but yours @163atk, confuses me. Sorry for the OT, but how can you have Dia Espada @ 163? Lowest BC is ATK 152 - 17 from first upgrade = 135 ATK + 5 from second upgrade = 140 ATK + 25 from third upgrade to Dia espada = 165 Atk minimum? Again sorry to OT, but I'm wondering if the "165-180 Atk" found here and the Japanese wiki are wrong or not? Thanks in advance
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badeko
Member
down w the army of darkness!!
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Post by badeko on Apr 15, 2014 15:14:43 GMT
If im not mistaken bc first upg is base - random number between 1-17 ive had bc for almost 8+9 months. I dont remember its base atk anymore (im nearly sure it was 158, a low atk since i was nub and just needed)
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badeko
Member
down w the army of darkness!!
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Post by badeko on Apr 15, 2014 16:13:12 GMT
So after experimenting a little more on this magic staff, staff etc enchanter user i found out that w dia(fg) kills adv ghoulie within how long drain lasts (~35 secs?) While wizard rod(shojo) would only do about the "e" in advance
I attribute this to the fact that dia has fg xtal in it while wizard rod has shojo.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2014 17:01:15 GMT
So after experimenting a little more on this magic staff, staff etc enchanter user i found out that w dia(fg) kills adv ghoulie within how long drain lasts (~35 secs?) While wizard rod(shojo) would only do about the "e" in advance I attribute this to the fact that dia has fg xtal in it while wizard rod has shojo. Yea, shoo is the same as Nothing when it comes to putting it in a staff and using drain(dark elements)
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Post by ManaKhe on Apr 15, 2014 23:16:56 GMT
Dia espada @163(+9) s/shojo vs leddle colon casting fire spear w fire origin (highest dmg 7375) Resty rod@173(+8) s/shojo vs leee colon casting fire spear w fire orgin (highest dmg 8k+) Same weaps but with added autoskill buff ,meleeing : results are the same Same weaps w added enchant buff, meleeing : results are practically the same Resty rod s/shojo @173+8> Dia espada 163+9 s/shojo I used dpr up s/shojo and divergent sword s/isu and lotus seed ns to test this. Resty Rod has a counter autoskill not an attack one correct? Dia Espada's autoskill is from melee attacks, meaning it will proc WAY more often. I'm actually surprised you only have that small of a difference in the damage between those two. You can practically discard the damage from counterattacks because they don't proc often enough, which puts Dia in a completely different league over Resty. Resty is basically not worth mentioning over other cane options such as Dielita, Amulet +, and Witch knife.
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Senpai
Community Contributor
meme ni naritai
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Post by Senpai on Apr 15, 2014 23:22:14 GMT
Dia espada @163(+9) s/shojo vs leddle colon casting fire spear w fire origin (highest dmg 7375) Resty rod@173(+8) s/shojo vs leee colon casting fire spear w fire orgin (highest dmg 8k+) Same weaps but with added autoskill buff ,meleeing : results are the same Same weaps w added enchant buff, meleeing : results are practically the same Resty rod s/shojo @173+8> Dia espada 163+9 s/shojo I used dpr up s/shojo and divergent sword s/isu and lotus seed ns to test this. Resty Rod has a counter autoskill not an attack one correct? Dia Espada's autoskill is from melee attacks, meaning it will proc WAY more often. I'm actually surprised you only have that small of a difference in the damage between those two. You can practically discard the damage from counterattacks because they don't proc often enough, which puts Dia in a completely different league over Resty. Resty is basically not worth mentioning over other cane options such as Dielita, Amulet +, and Witch knife. resty rod has spellboost effect, it's neither a counter nor an attack skill, lasts for 10 seconds, and renews whenever you recieve any attack, so it's basically being on steroids for enchant weapon skill.
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badeko
Member
down w the army of darkness!!
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Post by badeko on Apr 15, 2014 23:23:55 GMT
Well i wasnt thinking if that x.x
I tried wiz rod because it had that autoskill+2% and since shojo is almost like wiz rod (+5% fire water ice earth) itd prolly be good by using origin againstt whatever element mob ur fighting :/
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badeko
Member
down w the army of darkness!!
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Post by badeko on Apr 15, 2014 23:25:48 GMT
Oops checkn bk on what i type i ssid resty rod when i ment wizard rod lol..
Also my dia had fg xtal in it. Sryyy for theconfusion x.x
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Post by ManaKhe on Apr 15, 2014 23:33:52 GMT
Because of MDEF of mobs. Lets say you hit 8k on chako while I hit 6k. 2k MDEF on a mob would drop you to 6k and my to 4k. Now you get more MATK and start doing 9k to chakos while I got more and do 7k now. 2k MDEF now drops you to 7k, while me to 5k. The % gap in power between us has now changed. I'm sure this isn't EXACTLY how it works but it's pretty close. So because of mobs MDEF I get a higher boost in damage than you would from more MATK. I mostly figure it works like this because spell boost doubles my damage output while only increasing MATK by 40%. Only real way to explain why it boosts it that much. those damage you've shown is pretty much int/dex/agi from my conclusion and its in favor to magic sword which is totally unfair to cane user. of course, magic sword will deal more because you've build it to work with magic sword. cane build is slightly diff going for int/agi/dex. all these 3 stats will add matk to your cane using magic amp. the amount of matk gained with the right build is equal if not better but i can say for sure that if you're depending on trigger rate fully, then amulet+ is a better choice. for afk player that comes to rebuff every minutes, amulet deal more magic damage & more trigger rate at the expense of melee damage and weapon autos. for afk player that takes afk to the fullest, dia espada definitely better for its melee & auto mana wave. The damage I'm talking about is from an INT AGI DEX VIT build actually on my part. The numbers I said about damage against chako were too small for both of us tbh. Obviously if you are using magic amp you are an INT AGI DEX build over INT DEX AGI. I'm also depending on trigger rate fully; I could care less about the damage from my actual attack. I'm saying that Dia Espada is superior to Amulet+ for relying on autoskills. You will do at least 1.5 times as much autoskills using Dia Espada over Amulet+(with magic amp) and the higher damage that you can do per autoskill with Amulet+ does not make up for that fact. I actually think Dielita/Witch Knife are much better than Amulet+ and that it would actually be better to use Reduce Bangle/Lotus Seeds over magic amp, especially if you use spell boost or have more than 3 slots to work with.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2014 0:01:31 GMT
those damage you've shown is pretty much int/dex/agi from my conclusion and its in favor to magic sword which is totally unfair to cane user. of course, magic sword will deal more because you've build it to work with magic sword. cane build is slightly diff going for int/agi/dex. all these 3 stats will add matk to your cane using magic amp. the amount of matk gained with the right build is equal if not better but i can say for sure that if you're depending on trigger rate fully, then amulet+ is a better choice. for afk player that comes to rebuff every minutes, amulet deal more magic damage & more trigger rate at the expense of melee damage and weapon autos. for afk player that takes afk to the fullest, dia espada definitely better for its melee & auto mana wave. The damage I'm talking about is from an INT AGI DEX VIT build actually on my part. The numbers I said about damage against chako were too small for both of us tbh. Obviously if you are using magic amp you are an INT AGI DEX build over INT DEX AGI. I'm also depending on trigger rate fully; I could care less about the damage from my actual attack. I'm saying that Dia Espada is superior to Amulet+ for relying on autoskills. You will do at least 1.5 times as much autoskills using Dia Espada over Amulet+(with magic amp) and the higher damage that you can do per autoskill with Amulet+ does not make up for that fact. I actually think Dielita/Witch Knife are much better than Amulet+ and that it would actually be better to use Reduce Bangle/Lotus Seeds over magic amp, especially if you use spell boost or have more than 3 slots to work with. This is making things more complicated than it should be. Lets say both weapons have max int 200 agi 200 dex These are the stats that a staff enchanter would follow because every stat helps the matk. (just putting stats) staff gains 1024matk from int, 220matk from Agi, and 100matk from dex sword gains 1024 matk from int and 100matk from dex So which will cast more damage? Obliviously the staff by 220matk If the extra mana wave from dai is what makes the sword better, why not use the mana wave from dileta and still enjoy the higher magic attack and mana wave? Amulet helps all the skills fire more often. More often for more magic damage than a dia espada. Witch knife serves as a more melee approach, you keep almost the same melee damage and you keep a lot more matk than dai espada. Resty is basically a magic atrack overhaul. it already has more matk than dai and with the spell boost effect mixed with natural enchanter durability, getting hit is good. You hit this enchanter and it will send it back harder! The biggest disadvantage to magic swords imo as enchanter is the inability to adapt to situations. there are a variety of staffs to choose from to do whatever you need, and only one decent offensive sword which is dai espada. The only REAL benifit to a magic sword is the physical attack and the attack interval. But thats not where the bulk of damage comes from and if your magic is strong enough, it more than makes up for the speed and melee with the autoskill damage.
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Post by ManaKhe on Apr 16, 2014 0:48:35 GMT
I've seen people use flabellum and I've used witch knife, that additional hit has always seemed very underwhelming when it comes to autoskill procs.
Amulet does not make you fire more autoskills. I've said this multiple times already. I've said the reasoning behind it too, multiple times.
Witch Knife melee damage will be poor, if you want good melee damage flabellum would do much much better. You're first point was also that its better when relying on autoskills, not melee attack.
Resty has a spellboost counter, theres a spell boost xtal(albeit not convenient). It has more MATK, but no autoskills. 3 5k hits is better than 2 7k hits.
The variety of staves isn't what makes staves more versatile, its the option of using Magic Amp for crazy high defense mobs. Without slot specials this will give magic amp the edge on high mdef mobs while not having an advantage on low mdef ones. With slot specials magic amp will typically have the disadvantage in most cases.
Also 200 DEX is completely unnecessary. I only used that as an example for pure DPS. Would probably be better to work on survival(VIT>AGI for this) which is another disadvantage for magic amp use.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2014 1:34:40 GMT
I've seen people use flabellum and I've used witch knife, that additional hit has always seemed very underwhelming when it comes to autoskill procs. Amulet does not make you fire more autoskills. I've said this multiple times already. I've said the reasoning behind it too, multiple times. Witch Knife melee damage will be poor, if you want good melee damage flabellum would do much much better. You're first point was also that its better when relying on autoskills, not melee attack. Resty has a spellboost counter, theres a spell boost xtal(albeit not convenient). It has more MATK, but no autoskills. 3 5k hits is better than 2 7k hits. The variety of staves isn't what makes staves more versatile, its the option of using Magic Amp for crazy high defense mobs. Without slot specials this will give magic amp the edge on high mdef mobs while not having an advantage on low mdef ones. With slot specials magic amp will typically have the disadvantage in most cases. Also 200 DEX is completely unnecessary. I only used that as an example for pure DPS. Would probably be better to work on survival(VIT>AGI for this) which is another disadvantage for magic amp use. number talks. now get an amulet. dont judge something without testing.
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