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Post by simprince on Apr 28, 2015 15:52:21 GMT
Based on the sticky thread, there are two popular builds for guardian spammer, VIT/DEX/INT or VIT/DEX/STR. My questions are:
Given comparable gears for both builds:
(1) How much more damage can STR do than INT build in one Guardian?
(2) How much max MP does INT build have vs the STR?
(3) Considering weapon choice, does INT or STR build have any advantage?
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Post by nubyanraiun on Apr 28, 2015 15:58:34 GMT
I'm currently max vit,,int,str
1.I have 3k mp
2.I hit around 15k-25k with guardian
3.And Int for mdef and more mp for guardain and str to increase damage.
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Post by Jeancarlo on Apr 28, 2015 16:01:16 GMT
Based on the sticky thread, there are two popular builds for guardian spammer, VIT/DEX/INT or VIT/DEX/STR. My questions are: Given comparable gears for both builds: (1) How much more damage can STR do than INT build in one Guardian? (2) How much max MP does INT build have vs the STR? (3) Considering weapon choice, does INT or STR build have any advantage? assume 256 STR or 256 INT 1a Special Sword - will get +256 Atk more than INT build, plus any +ATK% that you're wearing. INT does NOT affect dmg for Spc Sword. Note though that at the level that you get a 3rd stat into 256 range, your buffed HP is so high that the HP portion of Guardian dmg will probably be 85% of your dmg 1b Magic Sword- will get +640 Atk (2.5*256) from INT, and does not get anything from STR. With VIT/DEX build though, you're still better off with 1a and Vit/Dex/Str build as you get 4.5 pts max possible vs 3.5 for Spc 2. 1 Int = 4MP. However, the higher MP pool just means better mp regen since you'll need pots regardless to keep MP up 3. Spec Sword = 4.5 max possible. 2 from Vit, 1.5 from Dex and 1 from Str. Magic is 3.5 max possible 2.5 from Int and 1 from Dex. Other advantage of Str build is for using normal swords. 3 atk per str and 1 per dex. Normal sword gives access to elemental swords.
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Post by lacs on Apr 28, 2015 16:06:06 GMT
i am a pally int-vit (365 atm) and to answer:
1- there is a formula for the guardian damage (str+atk)x4 this means that a int build using magic sword gets just (0+2.5)x4= 10 atk per int and the str build gets (1+3)x4=16 atk per str using normal sword, that is a LOT! so yeah, 60% more atk using the str build
2-the max int, as i use it, using 3 piton (cause i like the hp and mp % it gives) gives me a mp pool of 5k, when i get blessed, it just never runs out
a friend of mine is str vit build, he only has 1.5k mp, so he is really dependent on mp pots
3-well the int vit build is the pure tanker build, you just dont get any damage, hi ents? megas? baum warrior? bosses? almost all of the just deal 1 damage (except their special moves) and lots of mp, you almost don't need it, if u use cracked mage ore, you get a nice mp regen, i get 61 mp every 10 secs
the str vit build is the pure damage build, so god dammm powerful! yet they are weak to magic, even petinos can deal some damage on them with their fire magic, and low mp, the cracked mage ore is almost ineffective on them, they lose some tanking capacity, i prefer being a tank, cause that way i can protect better, my friend likes to straight murder everyone, so it works well for him
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Post by simprince on Apr 28, 2015 16:13:31 GMT
Thanks for the reply. I remember a thread where people talk about MDEF works as subtraction whereas DEF works as division. So does max INT really reducing magic attack much? I understand it will reduce but how about magic attack on a max INT pally vs a 1 INT pally? Does it worth max it?
Also, I heard that after maxing 3, INT build will pick STR and STR build will pick INT. So eventually they become very much like each other?
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Post by lacs on Apr 28, 2015 16:30:59 GMT
3a- normal sword (some say hihirochalkum hammer) has a really high atk using full str
magic sword using int, gets some decent damage, yet there are no magic sword that has hp+% so the hp is a little lower
special sword gives the lowest atk using vit, just 2 per vit, but almost all the special swords have nice stats for paladins
and yeah, mdef sustracts from magic damage and def divides, let me explain
if a boss deals a 10k magic damage and i have 2200 mdef, i receive only 7800 and if i use the skill fortis, gives 60% magic resist (aprox, improves by vit) i get 3120 damage, compared to the str build, wich has 300 mdef aprox, they receive 9700 damage, using fortis they get 3880, the diference is low using fortis when the magic atk is higher, but when lower
2000 matk -2200 mdef=1 always
2000 matk -300 mdef= 1700
the str build needs to use fortis always
def is calculated like this (def on equipment +refinement) this gives a number allways lower than 100, it's counted as percentage, for example 50 def,
a 10,000 normal attack (kinda absurd)- normal def(lets just say, 900) -50% (damage absorption from equipment) - mele resistance from stats and fortis (again 60% aprox)
(9100-50%)-60%
4550-60%
1820, that is the approximated damage received from a 10k hit
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Post by lacs on Apr 28, 2015 16:36:38 GMT
if there were a glitch to hack the armors def over 100, you will always recive 1 from every physical atk, but that's impossible, the max def i know is
5 from katz+ 30 of high def armor+9, 25 of high def add+9 and +8 from a high def special equipment
68% is the max def possible as i can think
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Yazmat
Community Contributor 
Pally Lv351 | Alchy Lv318
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Post by Yazmat on Apr 28, 2015 16:41:40 GMT
3a- normal sword (some say hihirochalkum hammer) has a really high atk using full str magic sword using int, gets some decent damage, yet there are no magic sword that has hp+% so the hp is a little lower special sword gives the lowest atk using vit, just 2 per vit, but almost all the special swords have nice stats for paladins and yeah, mdef sustracts from magic damage and def divides, let me explain if a boss deals a 10k magic damage and i have 2200 mdef, i receive only 7800 and if i use the skill fortis, gives 60% magic resist (aprox, improves by vit) i get 3120 damage, compared to the str build, wich has 300 mdef aprox, they receive 9700 damage, using fortis they get 3880, the diference is low using fortis when the magic atk is higher, but when lower 2000 matk -2200 mdef=1 always 2000 matk -300 mdef= 1700 the str build needs to use fortis always def is calculated like this (def on equipment +refinement) this gives a number allways lower than 100, it's counted as percentage, for example 50 def, a 10,000 normal attack (kinda absurd)- normal def(lets just say, 900) -50% (damage absorption from equipment) - mele resistance from stats and fortis (again 60% aprox) (9100-50%)-60% 4550-60% 1820, that is the approximated damage received from a 10k hit When you talk about Def working as division you are speaking about equop & refin def, but where is vit def in your math ?
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Post by lacs on Apr 28, 2015 16:45:27 GMT
a 10,000 normal attack (kinda absurd)- normal def(lets just say, 900 < ------ this is from vit) -50%
(damage absorption from equipment) - mele resistance from stats and fortis
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Yazmat
Community Contributor
Pally Lv351 | Alchy Lv318
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Post by Yazmat on Apr 28, 2015 17:20:01 GMT
a 10,000 normal attack (kinda absurd)- normal def(lets just say, 900 < ------ this is from vit) -50% (damage absorption from equipment) - mele resistance from stats and fortis Dunno how I missed that, sorry lol Anyway my point is that def (from vit) is just like mdef (from int), it is subtracted, not divided by. equipment def and refining ... that is another story  |
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Post by MiLiGRiTo on Apr 29, 2015 2:13:47 GMT
if a boss deals a 10k magic damage and i have 2200 mdef, i receive only 7800 and if i use the skill fortis, gives 60% magic resist (aprox, improves by vit) i get 3120 damage, compared to the str build, wich has 300 mdef aprox, they receive 9700 damage, using fortis they get 3880, the diference is low using fortis when the magic atk is higher, but when lower 2000 matk -2200 mdef=1 always 2000 matk -300 mdef= 1700 the str build needs to use fortis always This is the exact same reason where I based to justify dropping my INT. Also, Fortis also needs to be up all the time regardless of whether you're INT or no-INT. For big magic damage, the difference of MDEF is relatively small. For small magic damage as depicted above, MDEF will get 1 damage and no-INT will take 1700 - 60% fortis = 680dmg, which is fairly insignificant when you have 100,000 to 200,000 HP. This becomes even less significant because magic doesn't proc all the time. Most mobs and bosses will have regular attacks, special attacks, critical attacks, so the proc rate for magic becomes smaller. Assuming the proc rate of magic is 50%, 680dmg x 50% of the time = 340dmg on average. Now Guardian eats 2% of your current HP. If you have 200k HP, you lose around 4k HP each time you do it, so 340dmg doesn't seem to be alot. So basically I just chose to give more value to the 4k HP I lose from Guardian rather than give value to 340dmg I take from mob. It's like paying 4,340HP for 30k guardian damage versus paying 4,001HP for 20k guardian damage. Pretty fair trade off for me. |
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Post by lacs on Apr 29, 2015 2:43:35 GMT
yeah, biggest advantage of int is only the mp pool, that's kinda it, go hammer and full str and vit
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Post by MiLiGRiTo on Apr 29, 2015 3:02:56 GMT
yeah, biggest advantage of int is only the mp pool, that's kinda it, go hammer and full str and vit Well there's that and there are other advantages for INT builds. It's just that people need to look at it as a whole package to realize their strength. If people look at it in terms of just Guardians and MDEFs then they tend to get confused. |
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Yazmat
Community Contributor
Pally Lv351 | Alchy Lv318
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Post by Yazmat on Apr 29, 2015 9:05:46 GMT
Int is still useful for .... euh ... let's say someone decided to make a Holy Thrust Build ... LOL
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Post by lacs on Apr 29, 2015 12:36:45 GMT
holy thrust build is meh, even with highest int and matk gear, about thr int vit build, also raises matk that enhances healing, i heal myself for 4k, i also use viola, and i can counter magic for around 6k, the counter has a nice rate of trigger
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