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Post by abj13 on Dec 10, 2016 16:42:42 GMT
Hi all Gladiator fellows ^^ Are u still Playing ur Gladi? Okay, i try to make this treat. As we know it, another class got adjustment skill that make them more powerfull. Asobimo improve damage and survivability of them. And we all know and admit, gladiator is lack of damage. For survivability, we are not better than them. When wait for asobimo release new skill for level 300&320, im hope for them upgrade Pillar Blade or Tempest. But they choose upgrade astute to lv4, same as imode version whereas there are no Pillar Blade on imode. I am sure, asobimo will give adjustment for Gladi, and we must keep that hope So, whats Gladi's need for adjustment skill? In My Opinion is like this : 1. For Improve damage - Gladiators need more Attack stats like samu's, 1 agi = +1 atk. Atk on Gladi only increase with STR(+3) & DEX (+1) stats, mainstream build put 256 agi for increase tempest dmg but its not help increasing attack on stats, thats make gladi on high lvl only can put DEX around 1-200 points. And we still need CRT for output critical damage not like samurai, they dont put CRT stats too much because absolute clarity (CRT Up by Level). Also, we can got aspd fix penalty like samu's too. But when using tempest/berserk, aspd back to normal (like shippu jinrai). Or, - Make high damage from Sword Tempest works on normal mobs too, and add more hate from tempest. It will help Gladi find party on grinding. Because its hard find pt for grinding since we only do low dmg with tempest. Imagine of tempest dealt 200k+ on third eye, and can easily attract all mobs on our party. Or - Add multiplier from Pillar Blade or Tempest Sword damage formula. Because we need more damage for fastkill on soloing boss, or for compete with other class. My dps now on farm set is around 120-150k using farming set (without Esperanza), its too low for fight updated boss with massive amount of HP. Or, - Improve Esperanza. Tbh, Esperanze is like forbidden skills to me. Greatly Increase Attack and Def, but eva became 1 and exhaust is suck (50 sec and minus def,atk,hit rate,crit rate). So, i want Atk UP Increase from Esperanza is depend on STR and CRT/AGI. And shorter Exhaust time around 10-20 secs. Removing eva fixed to 1 because we need it for soloing bosses. Asobimo can remove bonus heal recovery. Or - Melee+ affect on double attack. When we fight boss with barier, double attack became useless with 1-2 dmg. 2. For Survivability - Shorten recovery interval form Regeneration, from 4 sec to 3 sec - Improve Solid Skin, affect on STR and CRT/AGI. Solid skin can reduce damage around 8k with 400+ STR. If other stats affect, Gladi can endure more damage than 8k. Thats it, what i want for adjustment Skill. I Hope Asobimo can read this thread lol. What about your Opinion towards adustment for Gladiators? Regards - abj13 - Lv 335 Gladiator *PS : Sorry for my Bad English since its not my Native Language
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 10, 2016 17:30:18 GMT
Thanks abj this is the type of convo we need...
People need to admit that we are badly behind and look at ways to improve things.
I think 3 main things we need
1 - tempest to deal relative damage to mobs as it does on bosses - this will give us a really good aoe skill that does decent damage, its not crazy damage but because its aoe and still can be over 200k if it was available to use on mobs then it would increase our party value greatly.
2 - remove exhaustion and eva debuff effect from esperanza so we can spam esperanza to up our damage and defense. This will be our main damage boost tbh because if we could spam esperanza and tempest dmg on mobs it would give us the damage we would need to be relative to everyone else.
3 - increase esperanza duration time so we can use use it without having to rebuff every 60 seconds.
4th thing (this is extra) - increase tempest damage on bosses, i dont include this as a main thing because we i already know gladiator main focus isn't dps and being able to spam esperanza without worrying about exhaustion and high tempest damage on mobs would be more than enough to put us on same level we need to be.
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Post by abj13 on Dec 10, 2016 17:56:08 GMT
Thanks abj this is the type of convo we need... Ikr haha.
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Post by Faylyne on Dec 10, 2016 22:17:51 GMT
Anyway I also waiting adjustments for gladi even tho I'm not a gladi ahahaha
The adjustment that u write in first point No. 1, u want gladi to be adjusted samu-like. Why not change ur job into samu instead if u want the same things as samu? xD The point that balanced with other job is increased tempest dmg, tempest should be work to mobs and made greater hate rise, like doing 200k+ on 3eye and tanking them.
Gladi adjustment must be totally different from samu or other job as well. Because if its the same like other job, it will be like Assassin's Backstab and Ninja's Silent Killing. Both skill described are similar, a skill that hit the back of an enemy. Similar skill but ninja has high survivability and ninja can hit the back of an enemy without standing rear-faced with them, they will prefer ninja as well. Also even after bs being adjusted, sk still do higher than bs (if bs adjustment is double bs rate 100% or BS calculation 10times of damages, it would surpass sk). I think this is Asobimo greatest mistake, its not balanced.
Nah, I won't the same things happened to Gladi. Thats why I said its must totally different from samu or other job. I hope much on gladi adjustment, since I'm the fans of Gladi and Id like to make 1 haha xD
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 11, 2016 2:48:03 GMT
Anyway I also waiting adjustments for gladi even tho I'm not a gladi ahahaha The adjustment that u write in first point No. 1, u want gladi to be adjusted samu-like. Why not change ur job into samu instead if u want the same things as samu? xD The point that balanced with other job is increased tempest dmg, tempest should be work to mobs and made greater hate rise, like doing 200k+ on 3eye and tanking them. Gladi adjustment must be totally different from samu or other job as well. Because if its the same like other job, it will be like Assassin's Backstab and Ninja's Silent Killing. Both skill described are similar, a skill that hit the back of an enemy. Similar skill but ninja has high survivability and ninja can hit the back of an enemy without standing rear-faced with them, they will prefer ninja as well. Also even after bs being adjusted, sk still do higher than bs (if bs adjustment is double bs rate 100% or BS calculation 10times of damages, it would surpass sk). I think this is Asobimo greatest mistake, its not balanced. Nah, I won't the same things happened to Gladi. Thats why I said its must totally different from samu or other job. I hope much on gladi adjustment, since I'm the fans of Gladi and Id like to make 1 haha xD I think the reason why abj says that agi should add atk is because tempest becomes stronger with higher agi so it would make sense to make gladi like samu for 1 agi=1 atk... Because our main skill requires us to have 256 agi. Actually that is a good point i never thought of... Gladi should defo get 1 atk for 1 agi.
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Post by Faylyne on Dec 11, 2016 7:11:58 GMT
Anyway I also waiting adjustments for gladi even tho I'm not a gladi ahahaha The adjustment that u write in first point No. 1, u want gladi to be adjusted samu-like. Why not change ur job into samu instead if u want the same things as samu? xD The point that balanced with other job is increased tempest dmg, tempest should be work to mobs and made greater hate rise, like doing 200k+ on 3eye and tanking them. Gladi adjustment must be totally different from samu or other job as well. Because if its the same like other job, it will be like Assassin's Backstab and Ninja's Silent Killing. Both skill described are similar, a skill that hit the back of an enemy. Similar skill but ninja has high survivability and ninja can hit the back of an enemy without standing rear-faced with them, they will prefer ninja as well. Also even after bs being adjusted, sk still do higher than bs (if bs adjustment is double bs rate 100% or BS calculation 10times of damages, it would surpass sk). I think this is Asobimo greatest mistake, its not balanced. Nah, I won't the same things happened to Gladi. Thats why I said its must totally different from samu or other job. I hope much on gladi adjustment, since I'm the fans of Gladi and Id like to make 1 haha xD I think the reason why abj says that agi should add atk is because tempest becomes stronger with higher agi so it would make sense to make gladi like samu for 1 agi=1 atk... Because our main skill requires us to have 256 agi. Actually that is a good point i never thought of... Gladi should defo get 1 atk for 1 agi. im not mentioned on agi only, he said too many "like samu" on that point, agi, crt, aspd xD
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Post by Crysta|'s hubby on Dec 11, 2016 7:36:56 GMT
They are only changing how skills work and the bonuses they give with them they won't add atk per Agi that'd be adding a whole new skill they might add extra damage per Agi but that's it I do agree that sword tempest should do more damage than it does now on mobs and more than pillar blade but only that much otherwise it wouldnt be balanced or fair to sniper at all who have high aoe dps but only so little HP you guys keep complaining that you are far behind but in reality you are just more balanced than most classes you have damage and HP even if its not a huge amount of both its better than most I have both sniper and enchanter over lvl 300 I can assure you any glad I have pted have had it far easier than my ench even after the update I do at max 100k to a single target with mblade as mblade build while maintaining around the same survival as glad. Only upside is I don't have to use much pots cuz of drain and mp charge but you guys have a skill to handle that as well (only mentioning my mblade ench because I saw tankyness of classes being brought up and its in my opinion the best solo tank) my honest guess is maybe they will buff up Esperanza pillar blade or sword tempest but they won't break the balance even more after trying to fix it with snipers update by making sword tempest do 200k+ on mobs glad definitely deserves more than it already has don't get me wrong but when they don't make you 1 shot every mob in iruna and able to tank Alma's at lvl 200 with no pots don't get all shocked and delete your gladiators in frustration
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 11, 2016 12:43:51 GMT
They are only changing how skills work and the bonuses they give with them they won't add atk per Agi that'd be adding a whole new skill they might add extra damage per Agi but that's it I do agree that sword tempest should do more damage than it does now on mobs and more than pillar blade but only that much otherwise it wouldnt be balanced or fair to sniper at all who have high aoe dps but only so little HP you guys keep complaining that you are far behind but in reality you are just more balanced than most classes you have damage and HP even if its not a huge amount of both its better than most I have both sniper and enchanter over lvl 300 I can assure you any glad I have pted have had it far easier than my ench even after the update I do at max 100k to a single target with mblade as mblade build while maintaining around the same survival as glad. Only upside is I don't have to use much pots cuz of drain and mp charge but you guys have a skill to handle that as well (only mentioning my mblade ench because I saw tankyness of classes being brought up and its in my opinion the best solo tank) my honest guess is maybe they will buff up Esperanza pillar blade or sword tempest but they won't break the balance even more after trying to fix it with snipers update by making sword tempest do 200k+ on mobs glad definitely deserves more than it already has don't get me wrong but when they don't make you 1 shot every mob in iruna and able to tank Alma's at lvl 200 with no pots don't get all shocked and delete your gladiators in frustration All i need to say to you is go build a gladiator to level 300 and then come and say this. I bet you 100m you won't be singing the same tune after trying the class for yourself. Its no where near as balanced as your trying to make it out to be... Tell me where the balance is when assassin's can stun a boss for 10 whole seconds and spam 800k damage per second? Your assessment on the class is based on nothing but imagination. Trust me if you were to test it then you would find your imagination and the reality is very different.
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Post by Shori>.< on Dec 11, 2016 12:57:45 GMT
They are only changing how skills work and the bonuses they give with them they won't add atk per Agi that'd be adding a whole new skill they might add extra damage per Agi but that's it I do agree that sword tempest should do more damage than it does now on mobs and more than pillar blade but only that much otherwise it wouldnt be balanced or fair to sniper at all who have high aoe dps but only so little HP you guys keep complaining that you are far behind but in reality you are just more balanced than most classes you have damage and HP even if its not a huge amount of both its better than most I have both sniper and enchanter over lvl 300 I can assure you any glad I have pted have had it far easier than my ench even after the update I do at max 100k to a single target with mblade as mblade build while maintaining around the same survival as glad. Only upside is I don't have to use much pots cuz of drain and mp charge but you guys have a skill to handle that as well (only mentioning my mblade ench because I saw tankyness of classes being brought up and its in my opinion the best solo tank) my honest guess is maybe they will buff up Esperanza pillar blade or sword tempest but they won't break the balance even more after trying to fix it with snipers update by making sword tempest do 200k+ on mobs glad definitely deserves more than it already has don't get me wrong but when they don't make you 1 shot every mob in iruna and able to tank Alma's at lvl 200 with no pots don't get all shocked and delete your gladiators in frustration All i need to say to you is go build a gladiator to level 300 and then come and say this. I bet you 100m you won't be singing the same tune after trying the class for yourself. Its no where near as balanced as your trying to make it out to be... Tell me where the balance is when assassin's can stun a boss for 10 whole seconds and spam 800k damage per second? Your assessment on the class is based on nothing but imagination. Trust me if you were to test it then you would find your imagination and the reality is very different. Err... Why are you comparing a semi tank class to a pure dps class? Also, gladiator is whining when beast knight still got over 4 month to wait for their skills? Some peoples need to be grateful they actually got skills >.>
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 11, 2016 13:06:54 GMT
All i need to say to you is go build a gladiator to level 300 and then come and say this. I bet you 100m you won't be singing the same tune after trying the class for yourself. Its no where near as balanced as your trying to make it out to be... Tell me where the balance is when assassin's can stun a boss for 10 whole seconds and spam 800k damage per second? Your assessment on the class is based on nothing but imagination. Trust me if you were to test it then you would find your imagination and the reality is very different. Err... Why are you comparing a semi tank class to a pure dps class? Also, gladiator is whining when beast knight still got over 4 month to wait for their skills? Some peoples need to be grateful they actually got skills >.> I know bk been shafted and i hope they get fixed too but what bugs me is people who have no idea about the class attempting to give tgeir opinions... This annoys me further when i think about the 2 occasions that my challenge to make a gladiator was met but on neither occasion did the challenger get past level 260, giving up based on "no damage and nobody parties me". Lets take a look at the class as a whole, no value in parties before 260 and very little value in party after 260. Infact let me ask you if you where grinding... And you had a bish hw and minstrel in party already.. Would you choose to party a gladiator to make party faster kills or would you choose Monk Another hw Sin Sniper Enchy (can hp heal and mp heal) Ninja Or even another bish? Now mq stops at 251... How long taking this example into account do you think it would take to get a gladiator to level 300? Have you wondered why no new gladiator in the game lately? Maybe because most give up way before 260?
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Post by Crysta|'s hubby on Dec 11, 2016 13:22:10 GMT
XD bruh if you want to argue and be an ass take it to private in mail
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Post by ringwraith on Dec 11, 2016 13:23:21 GMT
Err... Why are you comparing a semi tank class to a pure dps class? Also, gladiator is whining when beast knight still got over 4 month to wait for their skills? Some peoples need to be grateful they actually got skills >.> I know bk been shafted and i hope they get fixed too but what bugs me is people who have no idea about the class attempting to give tgeir opinions... This annoys me further when i think about the 2 occasions that my challenge to make a gladiator was met but on neither occasion did the challenger get past level 260, giving up based on "no damage and nobody parties me". Lets take a look at the class as a whole, no value in parties before 260 and very little value in party after 260. Infact let me ask you if you where grinding... And you had a bish hw and minstrel in party already.. Would you choose to party a gladiator to make party faster kills or would you choose Monk Another hw Sin Sniper Enchy (can hp heal and mp heal) Ninja Or even another bish? Now mq stops at 251... How long taking this example into account do you think it would take to get a gladiator to level 300? Have you wondered why no new gladiator in the game lately? Maybe because most give up way before 260? Yes i make same problem. No body will pt my glad for grind levels its too hard to make strong glad
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 11, 2016 13:28:41 GMT
XD bruh if you want to argue and be an ass take it to private in mail Not trying to argue mate but you dont exactly see me hovering around other class forums attempting to make assumptions about how their class should be made. I even have a bishop and ninja but not my mains so i dont give much opinions on them. I tend to keep my nose out of things i don't 100% know about myself, so when i see others giving their opinions on subjects they have no experience in, it irks me to no end.
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Post by Shori>.< on Dec 11, 2016 13:37:31 GMT
I know bk been shafted and i hope they get fixed too but what bugs me is people who have no idea about the class attempting to give tgeir opinions... This annoys me further when i think about the 2 occasions that my challenge to make a gladiator was met but on neither occasion did the challenger get past level 260, giving up based on "no damage and nobody parties me". Lets take a look at the class as a whole, no value in parties before 260 and very little value in party after 260. Infact let me ask you if you where grinding... And you had a bish hw and minstrel in party already.. Would you choose to party a gladiator to make party faster kills or would you choose Monk Another hw Sin Sniper Enchy (can hp heal and mp heal) Ninja Or even another bish? Now mq stops at 251... How long taking this example into account do you think it would take to get a gladiator to level 300? Have you wondered why no new gladiator in the game lately? Maybe because most give up way before 260? There was this saying, if you can't get into a party then make a party XP Also, those who persevere shall be rewarded (LOL). A while back enchanter and monk was the worst class ever, peoples still play them. Because they like the class. Fast forward, they got their upgrade and started to gain popularity. Those who stick around got to taste the honey of their hard work. A paladin was the main tank of the game, yet they once lose their job to the overflood of ninjas. Now they got a decent skill, and can finally held their head high (hell, I can't forget that one thread about some fb post stating bishop make better tank than paladin.) Every class has their own rise and fall I guess. Those who chase after perfection will just ended up running in circles. Yeah, I'm starting to sound like some 80 years old granma. I'm done.
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Post by The_Mormegil on Dec 11, 2016 14:16:46 GMT
I know bk been shafted and i hope they get fixed too but what bugs me is people who have no idea about the class attempting to give tgeir opinions... This annoys me further when i think about the 2 occasions that my challenge to make a gladiator was met but on neither occasion did the challenger get past level 260, giving up based on "no damage and nobody parties me". Lets take a look at the class as a whole, no value in parties before 260 and very little value in party after 260. Infact let me ask you if you where grinding... And you had a bish hw and minstrel in party already.. Would you choose to party a gladiator to make party faster kills or would you choose Monk Another hw Sin Sniper Enchy (can hp heal and mp heal) Ninja Or even another bish? Now mq stops at 251... How long taking this example into account do you think it would take to get a gladiator to level 300? Have you wondered why no new gladiator in the game lately? Maybe because most give up way before 260? There was this saying, if you can't get into a party then make a party XP Also, those who persevere shall be rewarded (LOL). A while back enchanter and monk was the worst class ever, peoples still play them. Because they like the class. Fast forward, they got their upgrade and started to gain popularity. Those who stick around got to taste the honey of their hard work. A paladin was the main tank of the game, yet they once lose their job to the overflood of ninjas. Now they got a decent skill, and can finally held their head high (hell, I can't forget that one thread about some fb post stating bishop make better tank than paladin.) Every class has their own rise and fall I guess. Those who chase after perfection will just ended up running in circles. Yeah, I'm starting to sound like some 80 years old granma. I'm done. The problem with all this is that Iruna is coming to an end (no more levels after 400), ep5 is meant to be last ep. those classes you mentioned have now got a chance to play Iruna before it ends with good classes that asobimo decided to fix. But gladiator will either not be fixed at all or will be fixed when the game is pritty much over, unless the patches we may get are actually skill upgrades like tempest 2 or pillar 2 which i doubt they would be. Also this would pose the biggest issue... If they do decide to give us upgrades on tempest 2 and pillar 2 in the next skill updates then someone choosing to play gladiator will have to wait more than 140 levels to get their upgrades compared to 40 to 80 for other classes. Fyi most hw in this game are straight up snobs, no patients or anything, the amount of times I've attempted to start a pt and have the hw leave because they want a dps class is just ridiculous. I gave up on leveling in parties at level 280, soloed my way to 344, only to get here and be shafted on the 300 skills a few months later.
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